A Conversation with Joel Jackson
Kake at sunset, looking north toward Admiralty Island in southeast Alaska. Photo by Joel Jackson
I interviewed Joel Jackson on June 15. He has served on the tribal council of the Organized Village of Kake, Alaska, for thirty years. The village itself is both a Tlingit tribe and a municipality.
Kake is on one of more than a thousand islands in the Alexander Archipelago, which spreads out south of Juneau, in Alaska’s panhandle along British Columbia. Kake is surrounded by the Tongass National Forest, the largest national forest in the US. Kake can be reached only by boat or small plane.
Kake's name in Tlingit is Ḵéex̱’. Quakers had a mission there from 1891–1912 and ran the government day school there. Kake is on both ancestral and current Tlingit land.
This is as much an interview with Joel's community as it is with Joel himself. He could not turn on video during the zoom call because his rural internet service is not strong enough.
Judy Maurer
You sent me an email a while back about having lost two brothers. That sounds like a lot.
Joel Jackson
I had seven brothers. I lost two of them to alcohol. Then I lost five more that just passed away from different causes. So I just got one brother and one sister left. I had three sisters. There were eleven of us total.
Judy Maurer
Oh, my. Just one brother and one sister left. I was just reading up on really high mortality rates in rural Alaska. That's painful.
Joel Jackson
Well, we're all getting old. I'm the youngest now and I’m 68 years old. We had one younger brother. He's one of the ones that passed away.
Judy Maurer
I really admire that you've taken that pain of losing two brothers to alcohol and making it redemptive, in helping a culturally-based treatment center get going. It seems like a really good way to deal with grief.
Note: On October 28, 2023, Sierra-Cascades approved giving $75,000 to Kake toward the development of a culturally-based addiction treatment center on US Forest Service land. Here’s more information on the tribal council’s plans for the center.
Joel Jackson
Well, I've lost a lot in my life. I've learned how to deal with grief, thankfully, or it can be devastating. I look at it in a totally different way than a lot of people, but I do feel bad about losing my brothers, you know. It's tough . . . I lost my wife too.
Judy Maurer
Would you like to talk about how you look at it so differently than other people?
Joel Jackson
When we were younger, our parents took us to funerals, so we were exposed to that early. We watched how people acted back then. They knew the cycle of life. They took it with great dignity. I really admired them for having that in such a sad time. I do get emotional, but I try not to hold on to anything.
The Organized Village of Kake
The Kake Dancers at Kake Day celebrations. Photo by Shaelene Grace Moler
Judy Maurer
To change the subject completely — the Organized Village of Kake — how big an area is that, if there are 500 people?
Joel Jackson
Well, I don't know how many square miles it is. We got one store. We got one gas station. We got a grade school, and we got a high school. We also got a senior center. Then we got what they call Public Safety building — police and fire department. Right now we're without police officers.
Judy Maurer
That's like the town I grew up in — it was about 500 people in the mountains in Arizona. Had a few bars, a church, all that.
Joel Jackson
Interesting. We’ve got a health center that's under what they call SEARHC — Southeast Alaska Regional Health Consortium. SEARHC was actually formed by the tribes in Southeast. They took over healthcare a while back.
The main hospital for the Southeast region is Mt. Edgecumbe in Sitka, Alaska. SEARHC has a pretty extensive campus in Juneau. They do all kinds of stuff up there. They're all across Southeast in almost all the communities. They're our health care. But to go to a hospital, we have to travel either to Mt. Edgecombe or Anchorage, depending on how serious it is.
Judy Maurer
Is that pretty much life in rural Alaska?
Joel Jackson
Yes, all the people in rural Alaska, especially the ones up north, they’ve got to fly to Anchorage to the Alaska Native Medical Center. We go up there because they have more doctors. If they can't take care of them at Mt. Edgecumbe, they send us up there.
Joel Jackson
By the way, back in the early 60s through the 70s, when I was in high school, and up to the time I was a chief of police when I was 19 or 20, I took over the chief of police job.
Judy Maurer
Really? At 19?
Joel Jackson
19 or 20. I was hoping to make it a career. But back then in early 80s, we had like 15 suicides in our little community in one year.
Judy Maurer
In one year?
Joel Jackson
Yep, in one year.
Judy Maurer
FIFTEEN? Out of 500 people?
Note: Mortality rates in Native populations in Alaska are high from all causes, including suicide.
Joel Jackson
Back then, our population was double what we have now. About 1,200 people. We were a boom, bust town with fisheries and logging. Now we don't have fisheries. We don't have logging around us. I was a police force of one most of the time.
Judy Maurer
A little tough, having no backup!
Joel Jackson
Yeah, a little bit! (chuckles) I was young and much stronger than I am now, but still, it would have been nice to have backup. I did have a deputy every now and then, but not too often.
But after that last year when we had all those suicides, I just couldn't take it anymore, so I left. I became a construction worker, heavy equipment operator. I didn't know I suffered from post traumatic stress syndrome.
Judy Maurer
Oh, I bet.
Joel Jackson
I didn't know that. I didn't know what was going on with me, but I started drinking, started doing drugs, burning my candle at both ends. I did work all that time, though. It wasn’t until I went to a conference years later. They had breakouts, and I went to one. I listened to what they were talking about, and that's when I knew what I was suffering from. It sort of sparked in my brain, okay, this is what's happening. I kinda got a grip on it.
Judy Maurer
I did, too, exactly that way. I realized I needed to get clean and sober, and then it was a whole lot easier to stay clean and sober, understanding the trauma, and that I had PTSD and all of that.
Joel Jackson
One of the things I learned researching the Cultural Healing Center was there's always trauma involved — whether it's alcoholism or drug addiction. To be able to identify what the trauma is and start working on that brings people a lot of peace. Hopefully it'll keep them sober. I got friends that used to go to the house and drink. After I got sober, quite a few years ago, they continued on. I watched them and talked to them. Now they're sober — have been for years.
I'm hoping my getting sober helped them understand that they needed to do it, too.
My uncle, one of my last uncles that I had that was living, I used to go and sit with him two, three hours a day. Just sit there and talk with him. I learned more about my grandfather and my grandmother and their family. One day as we're sitting there talking, out of the blue, he said, “One day you're gonna have to look at yourself, and decide what you want to do.” And I couldn't tell if he was directing that at me? But I took it like he was so I took it to heart and I quit drinking after that.
I was probably in my 40s then. Might have been a little later. But something hit me right then. When he said it, I took it to heart and decided enough is enough.
Judy Maurer
Wow! Most of us have to slam into a wall first.
Joel Jackson
Fortunately, I didn't have that craving for alcohol or anything. I was able to take it or leave it, even after I quit drinking. Everyone saw I’d have a beer. You know, I’d say I want to have a drink, so I'd have a beer and I wouldn't drink again for a long time. But then I’d remember why I quit drinking alcohol.
Judy Maurer
I don't drink because it calls to me too much. If I just pretend it doesn't exist, it's a whole lot easier.
Joel Jackson
Yes, that's what I told one of my nephews. He was a real bad alcoholic. He lived up in Anchorage. He had to almost die first before he quit. He ended up in the hospital, and a doctor called his mom and dad and told them to come up because he probably wouldn't make it through the night.
But after that, he quit. And after that, he called me up and he told me how many days and years he was sober. I finally said, “Don't think about it. Just live your life. Don't count the days anymore. You got a long life ahead of you, and it’d be better if you just did that rather than count the days. That past is behind you.” He even forgot the anniversary of when he quit.
That was my advice to him, “Live your life. You’re sober, you're doing good.” I’m proud of him.
Judy Maurer
So you're repaying the gift your uncle gave you.
Joel Jackson
All my uncles were great, but he and I were closer, probably because I was closer to him in age. But, yeah, that’s my father's side of the family – they had 13 children. I still have a lot of extended family everywhere.
Processing bear meat late into the night during Kake Culture Camp. Photo by Bethany Goodrich
A Treatment Center Grounded in Cultural Healing
Judy Maurer
What’s your dream for the treatment center on the National Park Service land? Your personal hopes for that?
Joel Jackson
I hope to get it up and running and make it available for the region – the Southeast region – mainly the rural communities, because the bigger communities already have programs there.
Judy Maurer
How does the cultural part play in? Do you have a sense of that? I know it won't be AA-based, which is what I'm familiar with.
Joel Jackson
It will be based on culture. We know culture heals, because after all those suicides, a group of us came up with our youth culture camp. It was our 35th year last year.
That came out of all that mess that we were in. We had to try to find a way to stop the suicides. One of the elders that was there in the meeting with us basically said the only people that could help us is ourselves.
So that got us thinking about how we could do that. So we started that culture camp that's mainly for the youth, and it's in July every year. It lasts a week. During that time, we teach them our way of living.
We ask the community for donations for deer, moose, seal, halibut, salmon — whatever they can donate. We teach the kids how to take care of that, how we process it and how we preserve it. That's a real important process in our way of life — a real connection to the land and the water and the air.
Judy Maurer
Not to mention survival . . .
Joel Jackson
We've survived that way for over 10,000 years. We're passing it on to them. Our elders go out there and talk with them. We have culture night where our local dance group will go out there and sing songs and dance.
Probably one of the best parts of it is the little ones. I think from 13 years on down, they get to go out for half a day. We bus them out there. I think last year we had over 50 little ones that wanted to go out there. We have the older kids do projects with them.
Hanging seal intestines during Kake Culture Camp. Photo by Bethany Goodrich
We have volunteers from the community, sometimes from outside the community — groups want to come in and see what it's all about, and they volunteer their time to do projects with the younger ones. We usually get a lot of help.
Judy Maurer
Oh, that's wonderful. And how many teens and all?
Joel Jackson
Usually it runs from 10 to 20. That's just the right amount.
There's also a lot of kids that are working — high school age kids. We have a couple different programs that hire kids to work in the village. One is called Alaskan Youth Stewards. They're real good groups to work with. They do a lot of things in the community — trail work, or just whatever we can find for them to do.
Judy Maurer
Community project work, is that it?
Joel Jackson
Yes, Forest Service work. Because the Forest Service gives some funds for it too.
Judy Maurer
Kake seems like a really active, caring community.
Joel Jackson
We try to do the best we can and try to help everybody. That's the way we grew up. We grew up in a community-based town. When something happens, we all get together and take care of it.
We have two clans, Eagle and Raven.
Note: “Tlingit people and Haida people are born into their identity through a matrilineal clan system: One's identity is established through the mother's clan. All Haida and Tlingit clans are organized into two major moieties: Eagle and Raven. In Tlingit, Yeil is Raven and Ch'aak is Eagle (Wolf is sometimes used interchangeably with Eagle). Each clan is made up of clan houses,” according to the Central Council of Tlingit and Haida People website.
If an Eagle passes away in our community, then the Ravens take care of them. From the time they pass away until they're put out on Grave Island, the Eagles take care of them. If it's the opposite, if a Raven passes away, then the Eagles take care of it. But from the very start, they make sure that they have enough food and everything, because at that time, nobody feels like cooking or anything.
Our tribe gives $2,500 for burial expense. There's couple organizations in Juneau, one of them Sea Alaska Corporation, they got a burial expense. And then there's another that has that. So it pretty much takes care of all the expenses of the burial.
Creating Jobs
Child dancers at Kake Day celebration. Photo by Shaelene Grace Moler
Judy Maurer
What I remember from growing up in a rural area is that just jobs are important.
Joel Jackson
Yeah, unfortunately, one of the biggest things about trying to create jobs here is our cost of electricity, cost of heating fuel, gasoline, shipping and transportation. So, it's hard to create jobs in a situation like that. We're actually looking at trying to purchase one of the local corporations’ buildings. They had cold storage. We're still talking with them, and hopefully we, the tribe, can purchase it, and start small businesses in there. One of the ones we're looking at right now is mariculture — growing seaweed.
Judy Maurer
That's a good idea. I mean, that's kind of the new trendy thing.
Joel Jackson
We have two people that are interested so far. So we're slowly getting there.
Judy Maurer
Does the cannery bring in tourism yet?
Joel Jackson
We've had tourism here. The local native corporation has been doing tourism for years here. They mainly cater to the smaller tour ships that come down from Juneau and Sitka.
I think this year they said there's going to be like 67 tours — small tour ships. We do get some of the bigger ones. They're not the real, real big ones, but they're bigger. They're probably a couple hundred feet long, and they hold 200 to 300 people
Judy Maurer
People who will spend money in the village, hopefully?
Joel Jackson
Hopefully they will. There are a lot of what I call “tourists on a budget.” They’re basically on a cruise and they don't want to spend a lot of money. If they buy anything, it's small stuff. So most of the people that cater to them sell the smaller things that they can make.
But we do have some big yachts that come in with some rich people, which is pretty good.
Judy Maurer
Oh, interesting. And what do the wealthier folks that come in buy or do?
Joel Jackson
There's a couple people that do walking tours.
Judy Maurer
So there's some money in that, I expect. What’s in the cannery? If I were to come to the cannery, what would it look like? What would I see?
Joel Jackson
Well, it's going good. We still need a lot of money for it. We got the building stabilized. That was the most important, because it was built in the late 1800s and although we did lose two of the buildings. They weren't stable, and the high winds came and the wind blew them down. The one we're renovating is the one that actually processed the salmon when it came in. It was the main part of the cannery.
Note: Kake’s cannery is registered as a National Historic Landmark. It was constructed on piers over the tidewaters near Kake. Operations there ended in 1977. Here’s loads more information about the cannery.
Judy Maurer
Can you give me a picture of what it's like today? Is it usable yet? Or is the renovation still ongoing?
Joel Jackson
It's still ongoing. We’ve got the water and sewer plumbed in, and we've got a sprinkler system plumbed in now. Bathroom, and we got a small portion of it renovated to house the tourists when they come in to do performances down there. We also got a commercial kitchen in there that's almost done.
Judy Maurer
Wow. What's your dream of how, what it will be?
Joel Jackson
We're renovating it for, hopefully, tourism and a number of the things that are needed in the community. We actually got a carver that's in there. He's doing that totem pole, and he's also doing a canoe. So that's what we hope to use a lot of that for — cultural stuff, and possibly a museum, if we set it up with the machinery we got there, and also tannery for sea otters. We're still looking at what we want in there.
We got into works we've been looking at for the last 30 years, as long as I've been on the council. We've been looking at an assisted living facility for our elders, so they don't have to go out of town to go to assisted living. We did a feasibility study, and we'll decide whether or not to pursue it after we look at the feasibility study. Also, we're looking at a Long House, or tribal house. That was in the feasibility study too.
So that's been in our wish list forever. We've finally got money to do the feasibility study.
The tribal house is going to be kind of a large building. I'll have space for people to use for potlucks or funerals or whatever. Then it'll have a commercial kitchen. It'll have some tribal offices in there to help maintain the building. I think we're going to move ahead with that one for sure.
Once we get the feasibility study back and see how much it's going to cost, we'll decide to go after funding. These have been in the works for the last 30 years, as long as I've been on the tribal council.
Judy Maurer
Wow! In my town, all we did together was put on a Christmas pageant. I mean, to get that much done with 500 people . . .
Joel Jackson
We got that ARPA money, so we're able to put some towards the feasibility study of these projects.
Note: Joel’s referring to the American Rescue Plan Act (ARPA), the US$1.9 trillion economic stimulus bill signed in 2021 to speed up recovery from the pandemic.
Yes, and we have good people working on it. So, we're waiting to look at what they came up with, and we'll move forward.
Judy Maurer
Is this unusual in the villages across Southeast Alaska?
Joel Jackson
We're pretty active, you know, across the region.
Judy Maurer
You talked about the local tribal corporation. Is that Kake, or is that also considered a tribal corporation?
Joel Jackson
Well, it's Kake Tribal Corporation. It's a for-profit organization. I am a shareholder. But I don't sit on their board or anything.
Note: Alaska has 229 federally recognized tribes, but only one small reservation. Instead, it has regional and village tribal corporations.
When Russia sold Alaska to the US in 1867, Alaska Native land claims were ignored and unresolved. As explained by the ANCSA Regional Association, “The Alaska Native Claims Settlement Act of 1971 (ANCSA) . . . extinguished aboriginal land title in Alaska.
“It divided the state into twelve distinct regions and mandated the creation of twelve private, for-profit Alaska Native regional corporations and over 200 private, for-profit Alaska Native village corporations. ANCSA also mandated that both regional and village corporations be owned by enrolled Alaska Native shareholders.”
Colonization and the Cost of Citizenship
Judy Maurer
Kake has a celebration in January of the commemoration of becoming an Organized Village, right?
Joel Jackson
Yes. In 1912, the City of Kake became an organized city. We used to celebrate that, but after we found out how that happened, we don't celebrate, necessarily, anymore. We were forced to choose between our way and Western way. We basically do that as a community just to have a gathering during the winter.
Judy Maurer
You had two bad choices presented to you all in 1912. Is that what I'm hearing?
Joel Jackson
One choice was to continue our way of life, and the other was to follow the Western way. It wasn't an easy decision for those people back then, from the stories we heard. There was big discussion among the heads of the clan houses — very big discussions that lasted for days. They described people crying. It wasn't a good time, but the leaders of each clan house got together and said, Okay, we're going to go with the Western way. And they built a boardwalk to the village, and when it came to the last spike at the end of the boardwalk, they drove a silver spike in that boardwalk. They said that signified putting a lid on our culture. So for years, we didn't practice that. We still lived our way of life, though, but our culture wasn't a big part in it.
Note: According to the Constitution Center, the original US Constitution said that “Indians not taxed” could not be considered citizens. In 1868, the 14th Amendment gave Blacks and all those born in the US the right to citizenship and equal protection under the law (in theory, at least . . .). Interpretations by US courts almost immediately excluded most Native Americans from citizenship.
The decision the Kake tribal elders faced in 1912 was that if the village of Kake organized as a tribe under federal law, their residents would be considered US citizens. Kake was the first village in Alaska to become organized. In 1924, citizenship was finally granted all Native Americans and Native Alaskans born in the US and territories. More on this here.
They told us we couldn't have our potlatches anymore, and we couldn't perform our dances and our songs. That's where the boarding schools came in, where they took our kids and put them in boarding schools. Their motto was “kill the Indian and save the man.” They tried to try to do away with their culture. Unfortunately, the churches were involved with that.
Judy Maurer
Yes. Quakers among them.
Joel Jackson
We do have a lot of people that are Christians. My father and mother were big supporters of the Salvation Army and went to church every Sunday. They participated in all the church activities. I grew up in that, but after I learned what it was that changed our way of living, it was hard for me to be part of that anymore.
I learned about intergenerational trauma. It's still happening today. I see it. I always wondered why are people the way they were? Then they came out with that phrase “intergenerational trauma,” and it made sense to me why I was seeing that when I was a child, why they were the way they were.
I felt sad because I watched it while I was growing up. I didn't know what it was, and why they were like that. Now I know.
I told people, it's time to heal now. It's time to heal. We know what it is. We know when it happened. We know what we need to do. Let's start healing.
Judy Maurer
Yes, exactly. I love that.
Joel Jackson
You can't live in negativity. I don't even let that in my life. I don't have time for negativity. I’ve got too much to do. I learned that people can say and do things to you, but it's all about how you react to what they're doing to you, saying about you. You can get mad. You can just ignore them. That's what I do. I don't have the energy to be arguing. If they want to think something about me, that's fine.
That's one of the things I really believe in, is that you can determine which path you're gonna go down in life. It's up to you.
Judy Maurer
I have a question. Before I learned about trauma, and before I was sober, people would say, Oh, think positively. I couldn't. I mean, first I had to get sober and I had to get healed. Now it's more of a choice, of positive or negative, gratefulness or resentment. But it didn't feel like it was a choice then.
Joel Jackson
Oh no, it never does. That's why you started drinking and stuff, you know.
Judy Maurer
That's right.
Joel Jackson
People always say, “It's not as easy as it sounds.” And I know it isn't, because I watch them. You have to get to the point where you realize what is causing it and start healing from it. That's really important.
The addiction center will be about getting people out there on the land and getting them connected with their culture. Because a lot of the people you know, especially the younger ones, and even some that are as old as me, don't know their culture because they grew up in the Western world. They forgot our values. The biggest one in my book is respect. I respect everybody. Yes, I talk to everybody. I don't care who they are.
It’s something we grew up in. In my household, my father and mother, we're always supportive of our culture.
They made sure that we practiced our way of life, and I was respecting everybody and helping wherever we could, so we grew up that way. We're just as poor as everybody else but my father helped as many people as he could, with food or money and all. That really struck me.
My father was a postmaster for over 30 years. My mother was a teacher for over 30 years. They were married over 50 years. Eleven children — eight boys and three girls.
My father quit drinking even before I was old enough to remember. We basically all grew up in a Christian home. My mother was active in the church and in the school and the community, as well as my father.
Judy Maurer
They could have both said, ‘Well, I have eleven children. I have to tend to my family. That's enough for me.”
Joel Jackson
They were active in everything that was going on in the village. Oh, I was pretty young when my father told me, when somebody passed away, “take the time to help them.” The locals would get together and, like I said, they took care of the burial. So at times it was pretty hard, you know, especially in the winter time. We'd have to go out to the Grave Island that we have here, and dig the grave.
Judy Maurer
Digging the grave in the winter by hand?
Joel Jackson
Yes. Sometimes it was very tough. The biggest thing was, after the funeral and the burial, they’d put on a community dinner. With the help of the community, they'd have a potluck, and there would be speeches during that time. If it was an Eagle that passed away, the Eagles would pick two or three people to speak at the potluck, and they would thank the Ravens for helping with the burial and everything. Then there'd be two or three speakers — however many speakers there were from the Eagle side — the Ravens would respond in kind with the same amount of speakers. It was the Ravens that gave their condolences to the opposite tribe and that created balance. Because our culture is all about balance.
It’s important that we have that, and thankfully we still have that today. No matter whether or not we liked the person, or you had hard feelings, or whatever, that was all put aside because everybody comes together as a community, to help the ones that were mourning. We still have that.
Note: Tlingit scholar Nancy Furlow of the University of Alaska Anchorage writes in The Alaska Native Reader: History, Culture Politics that balance and reciprocity are central to the spirituality of the Tlingit people. “Balance regulates all aspects of Tlingit life and it is essential that balance is maintained. . . . Maintaining balance at the time of death is particularly important. Balance goes hand-in-hand with reciprocal acts.”
I was pretty young when one of the elders pulled me aside at one of the potlucks that they were having after we had went out to Grave Island and prepared the grave and everything we're having a potluck. And one of the elders came up to me, he said, “you listen, because it's going to be your time soon to be a speaker. You're going to be a speaker for your tribe.” I'm a Raven. I thought maybe in about 5–10 years, I'll do it, not knowing that it was that night they were going to call on me.
So I've been one of the speakers for the Raven side for years.
Judy Maurer
Did that elder recognize your abilities then?
Joel Jackson
They must have talked amongst themselves and watched. I would go out and I would help out on the island — dig the grave and whatever, and help in the community. I didn't know anybody was watching. I was just doing what my father had told me to do.
I've always been grateful to be able to help out in the community any way I can. It's been a good life living in our small community.
Judy Maurer
Yes, the concept of balance. I think for the Diné (Navajo) it’s a sense of harmony, of reestablishing harmony, is that right? Is that similar about balance, or is that different?
Note: Both Diné and Tlingit languages are considered members of the Na-Dené family of languages. The Tlingit are more closely related to the Diné of the US Southwest than to the Inuit of the Alaskan arctic and sub-arctic regions.
Joel Jackson
It's all about harmony, having balance. Yes, that's harmony. We've been taught all these things, what we need to do, and to keep our community as close as we can.
We don't lose sight of the community. Some of our younger people still struggle with us trying to teach them, telling them “this is what you have to do, this is how you gotta do it.” I'm grateful because some of them are still going out and helping. It's good for them, too. Helping the opposite tribe, and in the community.
Judy Maurer
So you're a Raven. Was your wife an Eagle?
Joel Jackson
She was a non-native. She's from Louisiana. She spent most of her life here in our community. People actually thought she was native. She worked at our tribe for over 30 years as a social worker. She was very good with kids, real good with talking to people. Sometimes she’d get called out in the middle of the night, and I learned to get up and follow her.
I wanted to make sure she was safe. I'd just drive up and I'd watch.
We really didn't have much of a police presence here during that time, too. It's just something that we learned to do. We're always protective of our loved ones, you know?
Law Enforcement, Missing and Murdered Indigenous Persons
For years, the city didn't have police officers, so during the winter, when I wasn't working, I’d fill in for whenever there wasn't any police officers here. I’d answer the calls when needed, arrest people and take them to court.
Judy Maurer
You knew all of the people you arrested, right?
Joel Jackson
Yeah, everybody knows me, whether they're scared of me or respect me. It's just something I figured that was needed in the community. I tried to do what I could.
You have to talk to people, you know. That's one of the things. I stand up not only for our community, but all rural communities when I talk — for a lack of law enforcement and rural communities all across Alaska. I'm also part of the Murdered and Missing Indigenous Persons Group.
We just went to Juneau and talked to the legislature a couple months ago, and they passed a couple of bills to recognize what was going on. Unfortunately, a lot of those people are from bigger cities. They are not aware of how bad it is.
There's men, but mainly it's our women that go missing.
Judy Maurer
It's bad for being rural, but it's also a problem among the Indigenous population, period?
Joel Jackson
Yes, that's a real problem. For the longest time, they didn't investigate any of the cold cases. Now we got four investigators that the state has hired to look into some of the cold cases that are around Alaska. So we got that done. Thankfully.
A lot of the law enforcement, when natives go missing, they file a report. I don't know if a lot of it is investigated.
During that visit there, the Commissioner of Public Safety was at the meeting we had with the legislature. I've known that guy for quite a few years, and he knows how I feel about it. He's heard me talk on it.
So this last time we met and talked, he was more open to listening on how bad law enforcement is in rural Alaska and how the police departments don't really look at these cases.
It is easier for them just to say when people go missing, “I don't see anything suspicious.” But all the people that know those people that went missing say, “No, something had to have happened.”
Very, very heart-wrenching to hear their stories.
Judy Maurer
Yes, although there's also something consoling to them, to be listened to?
Joel Jackson
Yes. There was like five different organizations that came together for that meeting with the legislature, all basically woman-led organizations. I was glad they got together and became one group to tackle this problem. We seem to have made an impact on it, thankfully.
Note: Here’s more information on the legislation, including a quote from Joel.
Joel Jackson
I'm thankful to Jamiann, because she was meeting with the Quakers down in Oregon, I believe it was.
Judy Maurer
Yup. I was there!
Note: Jamiann S’eiltin Hasselquist (Tlingit, Deisheetaan Clan, Raven's Bones House) was one of our speakers at Sierra-Cascades annual sessions in 2023.
Joel Jackson
She called me up in the evening and said, Hey, I'm talking with these people. I thought I'd put you in the loop with them to talk more about it.
I heard about the Quakers when I was younger — how they were here from late 1800s to early 1900s, what they did here. It was a day school. As far as we know, there was nothing really harmful in the way of abuse and all. I haven't heard any stories. But the thing I learned, too, is our people don't talk about it.
Judy Maurer
Oh! So there's something there.
Joel Jackson
There's something there. I could tell that we were forced into this situation with the day school and all. That was bad enough for me.
I did try to listen to conferences of people telling their stories of different boarding schools in Alaska and outside Alaska — how they were treated, what happened there, abuse and everything. I sat in on a couple conference calls. I just had to hang up because it would start making me mad.
I just excused myself, because I couldn't do anything to control my anger. I just got angrier the more I listened to it. That was good enough to reinforce how I felt.
Judy Maurer
Yes, and you already understood, so that was enough.
Joel Jackson
Another thing that really struck me is how we affect nature and everything around us.
Nowadays nobody cares about what they're doing to old Mother Earth, all the damage we're doing to all our water, everything.
When the pandemic hit, I had an interview with a guy from I think New York. He called me up and he asked me about what I thought of the pandemic.
I told him, “This is nothing new. We've been through how many pandemics?”
He said, “You think the people are going to learn from this pandemic?” I said, “Look at all the different things that were happening in the world before the pandemic. Now, everything has come to a stand-still. Mother Earth is just telling us to slow down.”
Unfortunately, we're going to go right back to the way we were before.
We're very active in environmental stuff here. I met a young lady back in Washington, DC, when I went down there to talk about the Tongass National Forest. She came up to me at one of our meetings.
She came up and she introduced herself, but she's looking to partner with a tribe. And she said, “I live in Juneau, so I'm interested in partnering with the tribe on the environment.” So we've been working with her for the last four years.
We've been doing ocean monitoring. We go out there and take samples of the ocean. That came about because of the pandemic, because there were no more cruise ships coming to Alaska. So we figured out we should, because we had thought about how these cruise ships were affecting our waters.
So we started taking ocean samples while they weren't around, to compare it to when they start running again.
Judy Maurer
Do you have any conclusions?
Joel Jackson
No, it'll take about 10 years to really make the case. That'll be a while well yet, but at least we're monitoring it.
We Will Continue to Live Here
Judy Maurer
Is there anything you would like us to know about Kake or about life, the community in Kake?
Joel Jackson
I'm really proud of our community. Because we're still here. We lost over half our population after logging jobs and the fishing industry went out. The younger people had to move in order to make a living. So they moved on to different communities all over Alaska, and some outside Alaska. But the ones that stayed, the ones that are keeping our community alive . . .
People always hear us complain about the cost of living here. Everything is really high. One of the things they always say is, “Why don't you move?”
We tell them, “This is where our ancestors grew up. We're walking on the same land they did. This is our community.” Yes, no matter how hard it is, we will continue to live here. We basically live a subsistence lifestyle. We supplement everything with our ability to catch fish, hunt. Without that, we wouldn't be able to live here.
The ocean provides for us. We're what they call people of the tide, because when the tide goes out, we can go out and get our dinner.
Clams, and just about anything else out there, and what they call gumboots. We get a bunch of different things from the tide, and also along the tide lines.
Note: Gumboots are mollusks that grow so big they look like the foot of big rubber waders. Gumboots also grow in Oregon’s tidal pools.
Judy Maurer
The high point of the tide?
Joel Jackson
Yes, where the tide comes up to. There's different greens that we would gather from there. Then you cook them. There's a lot of different other things we get around this time of year. We eat wild celery.
Growing up, our older siblings and friends taught us how to eat different things that were coming into the season. Whenever we were playing outside, we'd stop and if we got hungry, we’d look for them. There's one — wild celery — you'd have to be real careful when you cut it down. You’d usually pick the young shoots and peel the outer side out, because out of that your skin could get irritated from it. So we'd peel that out. We'd sit down and eat it. When you ate it, you couldn't put your lips on it. You just have to take a bite of it and then chew it.
Judy Maurer
Yikes.
Joel Jackson
It was really good, though. There's different shoots that came up that you were taught to eat. It was interesting growing up in a small village.
Rural Education
Judy Maurer
What was the grade school like?
Joel Jackson
Back then, a lot of parents had big families. The grade school was full. It had five classrooms in it. They doubled us up because there wasn't enough room. So the first and second grade was together, third and fourth was together, that kind of thing. Those classrooms were full.
Judy Maurer
And now are they less full?
Joel Jackson
Yes, we got a lot less kids in school. I think we got 100 maybe in both the grade school and high school. I think our graduating class this year was only six graduates. But we don't have to send them off to boarding schools.
Judy Maurer
I worry, in general, about rural education. It’s ignored and underfunded.
Joel Jackson
Yeah, it's still that way. The legislature finally voted on increasing the funding for public schools. Unfortunately, our governor vetoed it. So that was a big letdown. Our schools are barely hanging in there with the funding they get.
I don't get why he did that. They could cut other things that aren't quite as important as education.
That’s a sign of times, you know, not getting enough funding. I can't believe kids go to those big schools, like in Juneau. But if you're determined, you can make it.
Judy Maurer
Yes, but it helps to have uncles like you did.
Joel Jackson
I'm really proud of our little community. Last year, I think we had 18 or 19 college students. Like my nieces! One got her PhD. Another one went through law school. She hasn't become a lawyer, but she used law school to get a really good job. She was head of First Alaskan Institute for 16, 17 years.
Judy Maurer
Hmmm. First Alaskan. What do they do?
Joel Jackson
They basically advocate for Alaska Natives.
Judy Maurer
I remember! I looked over their website pretty thoroughly. It seemed really good. I was impressed.
Joel Jackson
Yes. My niece finally stepped down, and she's gonna be home. I just recently got elected to two more years of being president of the tribe. So hopefully she sticks around, can join in and help us out.
Judy Maurer
What was the PhD in? Just curious.
Joel Jackson
I can't remember, but she basically did it on our culture. She’s a super-smart young lady. She's helping me with the healing center.
Judy Maurer
This is good! Someone who really understands the culture both intuitively and on a scholarly level, too.
Joel Jackson
That's important. I finished high school, although I was the valedictorian of my class, you know, and I got scholarships to go to school, and I told myself, I'll take a year off. I'll make some money. I became a police officer. After that, I went to the North Slope when they were building the Alaska pipeline. After that, I just kind of drifted around. I worked at construction for over 15 years. But that was my choice, and it was a good life anyway.
We’ve got quite a few professional people out there. We've got doctors, lawyers. It's becoming more of a norm. They come back and help us.
I'm very proud of our people, my community. We've got lots to do yet, but we'll get there. I don't look at myself as so much a leader, but a servant to our people.
Judy Maurer
Yes, you all will get there. Well, thank you for giving me all this time and your wisdom and stories.
Here’s a Washington Post article from 2014 on the impact of the lack of police officers in rural Alaska. Joel and his niece Liz Medicine Crow, formerly of First Alaskans Institute, were interviewed for it.
Contact Judy or Joel at newsletter@scymf.org
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